Apples are too expensive?
February 14, 2008
So Keith Elder has finally switched back to the “Apple is expensive” party line. Keith and I had numerous “debates” about this topic years ago, and he was *always* quoting the Apple fan line that “spec for spec” Apples are not just competitive with regular PCs but *cheaper*.
I know Keith knows he believed it back in the day, so I’m not pointing out any glaring inconsistencies. It’s just somewhat bemusing to watch someone’s progression in and then out of Apple fandom. In the non-Apple hardware world, there’s considerable choice – you can go barebones cheap or top-end best-of-breed hardware. Sometimes Apple might be more expensive, sometimes less, when comparing against top-end stuff, but it all depends on your needs. Trouble has been, Apple doesn’t make machines to cover *everyone’s* needs; at least, not when you factor in budget as part of the need.
I’ve got no real horse in this race. I write this as someone who has 2 Macs (emac from 2003 – or was it 2002? - and Imac from 2006). We’ve also got 2 ipods – one broke after 2 years and one is still working. But I’ve also got an Compaq laptop running Linux and XP (via vmware). I’ve considered a Macbook Pro (used) as a new laptop for later this year, but have no firm plans.
I also write this as someone who has a wife who Keith talked in to getting the emac in the first place. I even remember after we got it, it was dog slow (1ghz with 512 megs of RAM). Keith (and others) countered with “duh! 512 megs is nothing – you have to have at least a gig to run anything fast”. To which I generally replied “Why does Apple have a reputation of providing great end-user experiences but still sell systems that are ‘known’ to be painful to use?”. I would say that’s less and less the case these days, but it wasn’t easy, for me, to love an emac in 2003.
I’ve always maintained that Apple systems are generally more expensive than comparable non-Apple systems. And if you *don’t* use all the extras that you get with OSX – if you’re not using GarageBand and iLife and Pages and all that other OSX goodness, by all means Apple systems are way overpriced. It’s very hard to put a dollar value on ‘creature of habit’ behaviour, but if you really don’t use the Apple stuff, go buy a non-Apple system. OR get the latest Apple stuff, put Parallels on it, install Windows, and run both systems. You’ll pay for it – that’s a pricey proposition for the home user – but you’ll arguably have the best of both worlds for many use cases (except perhaps gaming).
Glad to have you back Keith. Maybe you’ll go full circle and start running Linux as a primary desktop in a few more years. 
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February 14th, 2008 at 10:19 pm
In my defense Mike, at the time I purchased my Powerbook and iBook for my wife it was a really close race in terms of hardware costs. I wish the article you linked to still had the link that I linked too to show just how about the same they were.
As far as your wife getting the eMac that was your decision. I didn’t talk her into getting an eMac she just liked iPhoto so basically you bought her a Mac for iPhoto, the eMac is just what your cheap butt wanted to buy and for the record when is the last time you ran XWindows in 512MB of ram comfortably? Operating systems are complex these days, they need memory!
February 14th, 2008 at 10:24 pm
I was not ‘blaming’ you for the emac purchase. You recommended to her that she’d like one, and she got it and liked it. I still maintain that selling it with only 512 megs was a poor experience for end users, and Apple is supposedly above selling ‘cheapening’ experiences.
Xorg with 512 megs is tolerable but obviously it’s better with more RAM.
That link is probably in archive.org somewhere.
February 17th, 2008 at 6:33 am
I am a recent convert to Mac OS. I got my Mac mini — the cheapest possible Mac I could buy — in December. It came with OS X Tiger installed, but also Leopard on a DVD.
I bought my Mac because I wanted to see if it would live up to the hype at a time when I was frustrated with Windows XP on powerful, but off-brand hardware, and also spending a lot of time tweaking a low-end notebook to work just right with recent versions of Kubuntu.
I have to say, coming from a Windows background and as an enthusiastic Linux dabbler, as a machine for music playing (via iTunes and our two iPods — one of which is a 5GB Clickwheel model from December 2001!), light sound editing (via Audacity), light photo editing (via GIMP and UFRaw), surfing and blogging, the wimpy Mac mini is a joy to use.
I’m not using LightRoom or editing movies frame-by-frame or using it as a recording studio. My needs and my wife’s needs are much less intense than that. But it sure is nice to be able use an existing KVM setup and bask in the aesthetics of OS X Leopard.
I see Mac OS X as my “pretty” desktop which works well even on low-end model hardware.
I see Kubuntu as my “roll my own” desktop which is not as pretty or slick, but I appreciate the customizability it offers me.
I see Windows XP as the OS my corporate employer makes me use.
To sum up: Apples are not too expensive if you’ve got KVM equipment sitting around gathering dust and can live with the hardware offered on a base model mini. And there are a heckuva lot of people who are annoyed with Windows and rely on their friends and relatives a little closer to the tech edge for recommendations. I’m singing the praises of my cheap mini to anyone who
(a) has griped about their Windows computers, and
(b) doesn’t have the time or interest to take advantage of (K)ubuntu, and
(c) who hasn’t already bought a Mac.
I tried to resist paying for another OS for a long time after playing with Kubuntu, but when I gave Mac OS a try, I was quickly and deeply impressed.
June 23rd, 2008 at 9:14 am
I’ll offer up this tidbit. I purchased a new 17″ MacBook Pro in February of this year. Comparing against the EXACT equivalent Dell laptop, the MacBook Pro was $80 cheaper.
However, and this is a big however, Dell was offering a discount at the time for $400 off the laptop. So depending on timing, you may be able to count on manufacturers heavily discounting their equipment to compete with Apple. Currently, the Dell is back to being more expensive.
I’ve extensively looked at comparing these two manufacturers because I was forced to cover the cost of the “more expensive” Apple equipment by my employer. You have to look at the hardware specs to do a true comparison. Sure you can get a 17″ Dell laptop for $1,200. But it is NOT the same as a MacBook Pro. (Not just processor but chipset and bus speed are the easiest way to match the comparable hardware)
A major reason that people construe Apple as more expensive is that Apple completely ignore’s the sub $1,200 computer market (With the exception of the Mini, but that is more a “first hit’s free” deal). If you are looking for the cheapest computer possible, yeah, Apple is more expensive. But if you are doing like for like, Apple can be a bit cheaper.